Bayraider20 - Strong wind sail.

[Graham W]

If the drum is correctly wound, it shouldn't do that.  You've presumably tried untying and refurling the drum so that the sheets wrap several times more around the jib compared to now? In which case, how about a different, smaller diameter furling line made of a stronger material than the existing version? Or failing that and more expensive, how about a bigger drummed furler, such as a Ronstan?

If in doubt, ask Matt. I thought I saw Amy Pearl at the yard the other day and if it's still there, someone there ought to be able to sort it out.

[Brian Robertson]

Yes, I have rewound the drum (many times!).  

I was trying to avoid moving to a greater length of smaller diameter line, as there is already a lot of line to deal with when the drum is fully unwound, but that may be the only solution.

I have a Ronstan continuous furler on my assymetric - its a great piece of kit - and I am wondering if it would be up to the job of handling the heavier weight of the jib.  Guess there is only one way to find out!

[Peter Cockerton]

Brian

Keen to convert to your roller reefing solution for the spinnaker, the ronstan bit of kit looks ideal, can you describe the set up please i.e is it wire between the furler and the masthead bracket, how does the sail foot and head attach to each end. Does it wind around the wire if thats what it is by just following the foot and head attachments.

Many thanks

Peter

[Brian Robertson]

Peter,

I have a Ronstan Series 60 furler (http://www.ronstan.co.uk/furlers/kwfurlers.asp).  My assymetric has a rope reinforced luff with a cringle at head and tack. The top swivel is shackled to the halyard and the swivel is attached to the head cringle using a clevis pin.  Similarly the furler itself is attached to the tack cringle with a clevis pin and shackled to the bowsprit.  The sail furls around the reinforced luff.  Simple but effective.

(The attached technical drawing and photo may make it easier to visualise)

[Guy Rossey]

Brian,
I imagine you have continuous sheets for the furler? How long do they go back and are they fixed on cleats?
Thanks.

_________________
Catchando Bay (BR48)

[Peter Cockerton]

Peter,

I have a Ronstan Series 60 furler (http://www.ronstan.co.uk/furlers/kwfurlers.asp).  My assymetric has a rope reinforced luff with a cringle at head and tack. The top swivel is shackled to the halyard and the swivel is attached to the head cringle using a clevis pin.  Similarly the furler itself is attached to the tack cringle with a clevis pin and shackled to the bowsprit.  The sail furls around the reinforced luff.  Simple but effective.

(The attached technical drawing and photo may make it easier to visualise)

Brian

Many thanks for posting the information and it has cleared up some issues and raised more. I have spoke to Ronstan and the current kit for standard sail is a  RS006400R which is reasonably priced at £292.00, however for asymmetric they reckon i need a top down furler i.e you pull on continiuos rope on the drum, the tack does not turn as it's attached to swivel on the drum but the turning motion is transferred to the top swivel via the wire which starts to furl the sail from the top down. This they say is required to help with an even furl of the sail. I spoke to Matt on this and his experiment with a bottom furl method ended with a bunched central element to the sail, he thinks top down could be the way to go. Unfortunately the top down kit starts i believe around £900.00 so out of my budget.

As your works with the rope reinforced luff and you are furling the sail around the rope luff not a wire this must be the way to go, so i need to see if i can modify my sail. As a matter of interest did you have your sail made with the rope reinforced luff or later modify.

Once again thanks for information

Peter

[Brian Robertson]

Brian,
I imagine you have continuous sheets for the furler? How long do they go back and are they fixed on cleats?
Thanks.

_________________
Catchando Bay (BR48)

Guy,
Yes, the furling line is continuous.  I have spliced a single block in to the loop and there is a rope tail on the block becket.  The furling loop is led aft on the port side through a couple of snap hooks on the side deck to about a foot short of the the aft cleat.  The rope tail is used to tension the furling loop on to the aft cleat.

I normally moor on a short finger pontoon in a fairly congested marina so for h&s reasons I always stow the bow sprit on deck.  The bow sprit and spinnaker are only mounted when out on the open water.  Lots of bits of string to sort out while under way, and I inevitably manage to get one of the spinnaker sheets on the wrong side of the forestay on first attempt, but I have got the process fairly off pat.  It's much more of a challenge taking the whole thing down in heavy weather!  But one of the nice things about the BC20 is how safe it feels sitting on the foredeck, even in a big swell.

Many thanks for posting the information and it has cleared up some issues and raised more. I have spoke to Ronstan and the current kit for standard sail is a  RS006400R which is reasonably priced at £292.00, however for asymmetric they reckon i need a top down furler i.e you pull on continiuos rope on the drum, the tack does not turn as it's attached to swivel on the drum but the turning motion is transferred to the top swivel via the wire which starts to furl the sail from the top down. This they say is required to help with an even furl of the sail. I spoke to Matt on this and his experiment with a bottom furl method ended with a bunched central element to the sail, he thinks top down could be the way to go. Unfortunately the top down kit starts i believe around £900.00 so out of my budget.

As your works with the rope reinforced luff and you are furling the sail around the rope luff not a wire this must be the way to go, so i need to see if i can modify my sail. As a matter of interest did you have your sail made with the rope reinforced luff or later modify.

Once again thanks for information

Peter

Peter,
I can see that the top down furler would be better - the bottom furler has a tendency to bunch the sail at the top.  I will put it on my wish list for when I win the lottery!

In light winds furling with the bottom furler is straightforward and reliable.  In moderate winds I find if I keep a downward pressure on the sheet when furling this minimises bunching and the spinnaker furls ok.  In heavy winds I go downwind and shadow with the mainsail to furl.  If all else fails and the spinnaker bunches I simply drop the sail.

The asymmetric came with the double rope reinforced luff and cringles.  It is a Jeckells sail, supplied by Matt.

Brian

[Peter Cockerton]

Brian

Many thanks for information on your asymmetric furling mechanics it has been most useful and i will be doing the modification on my boat, Andy Dingle has also expressed interest.

In my opinion this would make a valuable contribution to the library as i can see others wanting to make asymmetric handling more easy to handle and as such will be used more often. The information is also hard to find at present because its under strong wind sailing.

Perhaps you may consider doing the posting as you have been the main contributor.

Once again many thanks

[Matthew P]

An article on asymmetric sails and furling would be most helpful.
 
Would it be possible to include some recommendations on specification and sources for the asymmetric sail for a BR20 please?

Thanks

Matthew

[Graham W]

Would it be possible to include some recommendations on specification and sources for the asymmetric sail for a BR20 please?

Matthew and others,

Andrew Denman has also set up an asymmetric on a furler on plank-bowspritted BR20's in Australia http://www.swallowyachtsassociation.org/smf/index.php/topic,459.msg2867.html#msg2867  There is also a video of one of these boats (going like a train but without its asymmetric) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiR8tYTwA1I

I suspect that he used Ronstan furlers for the asymmetrics - made just outside Melbourne.

[david]

Hi Graham
                       Any updates on the performance of your head sail in strong winds or self furl etc

David

[Graham W]

Hi Graham
                       Any updates on the performance of your head sail in strong winds or self furl etc

David

I haven't been out for a bit - the weather has been fairly bad for a while now.

[Peter Cockerton]

Peter,

I have a Ronstan Series 60 furler (http://www.ronstan.co.uk/furlers/kwfurlers.asp).  My assymetric has a rope reinforced luff with a cringle at head and tack. The top swivel is shackled to the halyard and the swivel is attached to the head cringle using a clevis pin.  Similarly the furler itself is attached to the tack cringle with a clevis pin and shackled to the bowsprit.  The sail furls around the reinforced luff.  Simple but effective.

(The attached technical drawing and photo may make it easier to visualise)

Peter,

I have a Ronstan Series 60 furler (http://www.ronstan.co.uk/furlers/kwfurlers.asp).  My assymetric has a rope reinforced luff with a cringle at head and tack. The top swivel is shackled to the halyard and the swivel is attached to the head cringle using a clevis pin.  Similarly the furler itself is attached to the tack cringle with a clevis pin and shackled to the bowsprit.  The sail furls around the reinforced luff.  Simple but effective.

(The attached technical drawing and photo may make it easier to visualise)

Brian

Tried the furler on my boat yesterday at Rutland and i need to modify the attachment method to the pole. The problem i have is the drum angle and the furling line, the drum takes a natural angle of the sail i.e say 70 degrees which means the furling line also adopts that angle and will only furl if pulled from a similar angle. So i guess i need to distance the drum up from the pole and have the furl sheets guided through a fairlead arrangement.
Im not sure how best to attach the drum now to create the distance from the pole, im thinking soft shackle, chain, stainless tube etc did you do this or have i got it wrong. The furler by the way is a cheaper RWO variety.

Thanks

Peter