Author Topic: Electrical autonomy  (Read 2729 times)

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Graham W

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Electrical autonomy
« on: 20 Feb 2024, 16:05 »
The number of hours that you can get out of a house battery running your navigation instruments varies depending on whether you rely on shiny systems from the big manufacturers like Garmin, have a more modest system from the likes of NASA or view your data on a mobile phone or tablet.

I have the following data derived from a mixture of solar-powered Tacktick displays and transducers and powered NMEA 0183 sensors, all of which are broadcast over wifi by a multiplexer:
Apparent wind speed and direction
Position
Speed and course over ground
Depth
Sea temperature

Producing these measures and reading them only on the solar-powered Tacktick displays consumes less than 3Wh. So with a Tracer 288Wh lithium battery, I should have autonomy from shore power for at least a week’s worth of sailing.  One of those small Yuasa burglar alarm AGM batteries that the yard used to supply as standard would still run the system for a full day and a bit.

The power consumption increases by a further 2Wh if the data is viewed over wifi on an iPhone (while also showing navigation charts), assuming that the phone needs recharging every now and then.  If viewed on a tablet like the Sailproof 10”, the extra consumption might be as much as 10Wh.  So the tablet and all the sensors could be powered by the Tracer lithium battery non-stop for two to three days. 

The difference in consumption between continuously looking at this data on a big tablet or instead relying on a GPS/fishfinder from one of the big companies is not that great.  For example a Garmin Echomap with a 7” screen consumes roughly the same amount of power as my system viewed over the Sailproof 10”.  The difference is that out at sea, I can turn off the Sailproof screen (or swap to an iPhone) to save power and can still see all or most of the data on the Tacktick displays, whereas with a Garmin or similar, it’s all or nothing.

The advent of colour e-ink displays will significantly change all of these equations for the better, as they hardly use any power at all, especially if they do not have a high refresh rate.  In the meantime, autonomy from shore power can be extended by having a spare battery, by solar charging or even by tapping into the battery of an electric outboard.  The battery on my eProp outboard has over four times the capacity of my Tracer house battery.  So the trade-off would be between running the power-hungry parts of the display and not increasing range anxiety by too much.  With solar charging in sunnier climes, this is probably not much of an issue at all.
Graham
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Andy Stobbart

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #1 on: 23 Feb 2024, 07:50 »
I have acquired, without any clear power strategy, 4 LiFePo4 battery options fir use on board:-
A 10ah in a battery box fixed into the deck in front of the centreboard case, this has a 12v lighter socket and is also wired via the centreboard case to my chartplotter/ff.
A 50 ah which i use ashore and for my electric winch but which can also be lifted into one of the lockers to power 12v devices such as light, ballast pump & w.h.y. I would like to have more power off-take options on this battery (USB in particular) but at the moment it is just 12v.
A 5ah electric drill battery that has a clip on USB port to allow me to power/charge USB devices.
A camping light (to use as an anchor light) that I power with 4xUSB chargeable LiFePo4 D cell batteries (which can be recharged from the drill battery).
There’s also the e-Propulsion battery but that can only be used with the motor.

Graham W

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #2 on: 23 Feb 2024, 10:11 »
There’s also the e-Propulsion battery but that can only be used with the motor.

There’s an eProp accessory available that allows you to tap into the Spirit battery’s 48V https://www.epropulsion.com/product-page/spirit-battery-power-output-set/.  You then need to attach its output to a step-down converter to reduce this to 12V, such as this one https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/394895329297.

Not a cheap solution but it massively increases available capacity for more power-hungry accessories like a ballast water pump and an air pump for an inflatable boat and beach rollers.  At the expense of your outboard’s range, obviously.

In the UK, I tried several times to buy the power output set from eProp distributor Nestaway Boats but kept getting fobbed off.  In the end, I found Seamark Nunn altogether more obliging.
Graham
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Sea Simon

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #3 on: 23 Feb 2024, 19:48 »
There’s also the e-Propulsion battery but that can only be used with the motor.

There’s an eProp accessory available that allows you to tap into the Spirit battery’s 48V https://www.epropulsion.com/product-page/spirit-battery-power-output-set/.

Not a cheap solution

In the UK, I tried several times to buy the power output set from eProp distributor Nestaway Boats but kept getting fobbed off.  In the end, I found Seamark Nunn altogether more obliging.

Crikey. That's  a lot of money for a plug and a fly lead!
BRe # 52 - "Two Sisters"  2016. Plank sprit, conventional jib. Asym spinn. Coppercoat. Honda 5. SOLD Nov 2022....
...From Oct 22.
BC 26 #1001. "Two Sisters 2", 2013. Alloy spars, Bermudan Sloop; fixed twin spade rudders, Beta diesel saildrive. Lift keel with lead bulb. Coppercoat. Cornwall UK.

Graham W

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #4 on: 23 Feb 2024, 21:45 »
Crikey. That's  a lot of money for a plug and a fly lead!

Agreed, although there are also some electronic bits included in the set.  Also, it’s a lot cheaper than buying a Tracer battery!
Graham
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Andy Stobbart

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #5 on: 24 Feb 2024, 21:49 »
Graham,

Thanks for drawing my attention to the ePropulsion spirit-battery-power-output-kit - i had no idea it existed (can’t find one let alone a price here in NZ!).
That said, at the price, which will probably come out at around NZ$500 or more (especially if shipped from overseas) I think I will be happy to stick with my ‘separate 12v battery’ alternative!

Graham W

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #6 on: 26 Feb 2024, 10:49 »
An additional benefit of having a lot of battery capacity is that it can run LED lighting and the wifi router during household power cuts.  Where I live in rural North Kent, these are frequent and often quite extensive during the winter.  We’re in the middle of one at the moment because of downed cables and they don’t expect to sort it out for several hours.  We have no mobile signal here but do have gas for cooking.  The gas boiler and central heating circulation pumps don’t work without electricity, so I’ve fired up the wood-burning stove.  We’ll survive!
Graham
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Graham W

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #7 on: 27 Feb 2024, 11:20 »
Further and further off topic - our power went back on after 13 hours.  My claim for £90 compensation has already been accepted.  That will pay for some of the extra wiring and other stuff that I've had to buy for when the grid keeps letting us down.

Interestingly, the wifi router was battery powered without any issues for the whole time.  Not so the service from the internet provider, which failed after 12 hours.  My suspicion is that our local internet junction box (BT/Plusnet) has a UPS that couldn't cope with the extended mains power outage.
Graham
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David H

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #8 on: 15 Mar 2024, 08:16 »
I am considering replacing the two "DOA" conventional batteries (situated forward under the infill panel of our BC23) with a pair of these: Redodo 12V 100Ah Mini LiFePO4 Lithium Battery available from Amazon.de (the actual link a bit too large to post!), together with compatible solar/mains chargers. I understand this type of battery to be the safest Lithium type, nonetheless I am wondering if I should be concerned about overheating in an enclosed space. Yours thoughts please, thanks.

Graham W

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #9 on: 15 Mar 2024, 09:51 »
https://www.amazon.de/Redodo-LiFePO4-Lithium-Battery-4000-15000/dp/B0C2HQBN21/ref=sr_1_1_sspa

Removed everything in the link after and including the question mark.
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David H

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #10 on: 15 Mar 2024, 16:25 »
Many thanks for simplifying the link.

David

David H

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #11 on: 16 Mar 2024, 10:52 »
This looks like the same model under a different brand ……

https://www.amazon.de/LiFePO4-Battery-Lightweight-Lifespan-Off-Grid/dp/B0C4H6PP6S

Sea Simon

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Re: Electrical autonomy. Lightweight?
« Reply #12 on: 16 Mar 2024, 13:37 »
Please excuse my ignorance.
But what makes for a "lightweight" LiFePO4 battery, as opposed to a standard LiFePO4?
BRe # 52 - "Two Sisters"  2016. Plank sprit, conventional jib. Asym spinn. Coppercoat. Honda 5. SOLD Nov 2022....
...From Oct 22.
BC 26 #1001. "Two Sisters 2", 2013. Alloy spars, Bermudan Sloop; fixed twin spade rudders, Beta diesel saildrive. Lift keel with lead bulb. Coppercoat. Cornwall UK.

Graham W

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Re: Electrical autonomy
« Reply #13 on: 16 Mar 2024, 14:05 »
Apparently 1-2kg, a bit of volume and >€40!
Graham
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